Prosper.com: Convincing My Wife, Part 2
...she ain't convinced yet.
In my continued efforts to convince my wife that Prosper.com is a good investment, I'll analyze another aspect of the website today. Today I'll study what makes the successful lenders successful, what makes the average lenders average, and what makes the biggest losers, well, the biggest losers. I'll be moving my analysis platform to a fabulous website that focuses solely on Prosper.com lender and loan data, EricsCC.com.
To get things moving along quickly, consider the following graph that shows all lenders' rates of return on a seemingly normal distribution curve (please click any graphic to enlarge it):
As you can see, the majority of lenders are making money, and a significant majority are also earning a higher rate of return than they would earn in a traditional savings account. However, of all the non-average lenders, there are more that are doing exceptionally poor than doing exceptionally well. This indicates that if you do not follow a reasonable, disciplined investment strategy, you are more likely to lose at a high rate vs gain at a high rate. I guess the same could be said about the stock market. Essentially, it's easier to make mistakes than it is to get lucky.
Do you ever watch that show called The Biggest Loser on NBC? Well meet the biggest loser on Prosper.com: scoobydoo. Here is a graphical representation of his investments:
As Antonio from the Merchant of Venice would say, His "ventures are in one bottom trusted." This guy has invested a lot of money into Prosper.com and has given several large loans to people with C-grade credit. If one or two of those loans defaults, his ship will have sunk.
Let's look at another big loser's profile. How about jasonpeery:
Here's another guy that has a poor, lazy investment strategy. He has invested over $50,000 in Prosper.com listings and has scores of late payments and defaults. This guy has made several individual loans over $1,000, including one that is in default for $11,000! Why in the hell would you EVER loan $11,000 to a person with high-risk credit? And without even asking them a question! I sure hope that jasonpeery is better at personal finance than he is at determining to whom he should lend his money. As Neil Boortz would say, I bet that this guy has a lot of rent-to-own furniture in his house. My guess is that this guy's grandmother died recently and left him a bunch of money. No one that worked for $11,000 and saved it would ever be that careless in giving it to a single high-risk stranger.
One thing to remember about Prosper.com's fee structure is that all individual loan fees are passed along to the borrower except for a 1% loan servicing fee which is paid by the lender. This means that, statistically speaking, there is no reason to invest more than $50 in ANY candidate. Period. If I lend $500 to one person or $50 to ten people, I will pay the same loan servicing fee. And though I may save a little time by investing more money in lower-risk candidates, it's just plain silly to not diversify to the max with sub-prime borrowers.
OK, so let's look at someone with an average return. Consider the portfolio of helpishere777:
Ahh, this is refreshing. This user is right in the middle. He is earning about 11% interest, which takes into account the probability of his late payments going into default. He has invested the same $50,000 that our last big loser had invested, but in a completely different way. Look at the nice even relationship between all of the blue and green lines. Do you know why they're all equal? Because he invested the same $50 into every single loan. He understands that in order to mitigate his risk, he needs to diversify -- especially if he can do it at no additional cost!
Now let's look at the best lender. I'm not going to evaluate the person earning the highest return on his money. Currently that person is DrakeCO, who is earning about 33.6% interest. However, the average length of his loans is less than one month and most of his loans have been large amounts (max of $1,500) to high risk borrowers. Because of the youth of his loans and the nature of his strategy, he is bound to fail. Instead, I'm going to look at someone earning about 20% return with a reasonably large average loan period (if it's not old, the borrowers don't have time to be late!) and a significant amount of money. It looks to me like the golden child of Prosper.com is brother_tam. Here is his portfolio:

brother_tam is obviously smart and probably a little lucky. He has invested a little more than $10,000 in Prosper.com, mostly in $50 increments. Of his 224 loans, he has given more than $50 only 13 times, probably just to spice up his account. As a lender that understands the need to diversify. He is aware that he can invest in lower-credit borrowers because of his discipline. But he doesn't invest in only low-credit borrowers. He has a nice normal distribution of his loans that has a mean slightly on the low-credit side.
To be a successful lender on Prosper.com, you need to stick with a disciplined strategy that is formulated around the values of diversification and a normally distributed loan strategy. When choosing which loans to bid on, consider your current portfolio and establish a quota. "Right now, 75% of my loans are to high-risk borrowers. I should invest in some low-risk borrowers."
Remember: there is no penalty for investing the minimum amount in a person. And with more than 2,300 active listings, you shouldn't run out of people to lend to.
If she's still not convinced, I'll have to write more tomorrow.
In my continued efforts to convince my wife that Prosper.com is a good investment, I'll analyze another aspect of the website today. Today I'll study what makes the successful lenders successful, what makes the average lenders average, and what makes the biggest losers, well, the biggest losers. I'll be moving my analysis platform to a fabulous website that focuses solely on Prosper.com lender and loan data, EricsCC.com.
To get things moving along quickly, consider the following graph that shows all lenders' rates of return on a seemingly normal distribution curve (please click any graphic to enlarge it):
Do you ever watch that show called The Biggest Loser on NBC? Well meet the biggest loser on Prosper.com: scoobydoo. Here is a graphical representation of his investments:
Let's look at another big loser's profile. How about jasonpeery:
One thing to remember about Prosper.com's fee structure is that all individual loan fees are passed along to the borrower except for a 1% loan servicing fee which is paid by the lender. This means that, statistically speaking, there is no reason to invest more than $50 in ANY candidate. Period. If I lend $500 to one person or $50 to ten people, I will pay the same loan servicing fee. And though I may save a little time by investing more money in lower-risk candidates, it's just plain silly to not diversify to the max with sub-prime borrowers.
OK, so let's look at someone with an average return. Consider the portfolio of helpishere777:
Now let's look at the best lender. I'm not going to evaluate the person earning the highest return on his money. Currently that person is DrakeCO, who is earning about 33.6% interest. However, the average length of his loans is less than one month and most of his loans have been large amounts (max of $1,500) to high risk borrowers. Because of the youth of his loans and the nature of his strategy, he is bound to fail. Instead, I'm going to look at someone earning about 20% return with a reasonably large average loan period (if it's not old, the borrowers don't have time to be late!) and a significant amount of money. It looks to me like the golden child of Prosper.com is brother_tam. Here is his portfolio:
brother_tam is obviously smart and probably a little lucky. He has invested a little more than $10,000 in Prosper.com, mostly in $50 increments. Of his 224 loans, he has given more than $50 only 13 times, probably just to spice up his account. As a lender that understands the need to diversify. He is aware that he can invest in lower-credit borrowers because of his discipline. But he doesn't invest in only low-credit borrowers. He has a nice normal distribution of his loans that has a mean slightly on the low-credit side.
To be a successful lender on Prosper.com, you need to stick with a disciplined strategy that is formulated around the values of diversification and a normally distributed loan strategy. When choosing which loans to bid on, consider your current portfolio and establish a quota. "Right now, 75% of my loans are to high-risk borrowers. I should invest in some low-risk borrowers."
Remember: there is no penalty for investing the minimum amount in a person. And with more than 2,300 active listings, you shouldn't run out of people to lend to.
If she's still not convinced, I'll have to write more tomorrow.
Labels: borrow, compare, crunching, data collection, financial planning, free finance, free services, inform, investment, peer to peer lending, personal finance, personal goals, profit, prosper.com, strategy


5 Comments:
At September 17, 2008 12:45 PM ,
Steve said...
Here is a link to EricCC's page for me.
http://www.ericscc.com/lenders/LenderS23
My ROI according to that site is 14.66%, a bit above the average return for lenders. Keep in mind that is the expected return including expected defaults and fees - the average interest rate I'm lending at is 23.10%.
You can also see that my investments are a little off balance, skewed towards higher risk borrowers. As I invest more, I will try to balance this out. When I first invested in Prosper, I put in the minimum amount of $250 and invested in 5 loans at $50 each, and kept it spread evenly by credit rating. I got a little off of that when I put another $250 in a few months later, and went with a little more risk.
The first step to choosing a loan is definitely looking at the credit rating, DTI, and other things Scott has talked about. However, once you have some candidate loans that seem to have a similar level of risk, you need some other input to choose who you are actually going to trust to give you a return on your money.
As I followed those loans and read more about Prosper, I saw that there are ways to hedge your bets a little bit. On loan listings, you can see things that Scott hasn't gotten into yet, like whether they are a homeowner, number of lines of credit, credit line usage by %, income, group affiliation, endorsements, and the all important borrower-written section.
The borrower-written section is where people write about what they are using the loan for, why the need it, usually list monthly expenses vs income, etc. This is the only section that Prosper cannot verify. Prosper verifies credit, income, etc. This section can be a sob story, but it often has some key information (assuming it is true). One thing I like to look for is a claim that they have a spouse who's income is not included in the verified income listed with the loan. While this section can often be a distraction from making a good financial decision, if you read it carefully, you can usually tell if the borrower is spiraling out of control, or if they have really thought about their financial situation enough to be responsible for a loan.
The group affiliation is a very important part of Prosper. If a borrower is part of a group, that means the group has an overall rating. That rating goes up when all of the members make payments on time, and down if any member is late or defaults. So, to become a member of a group, borrower's peers usually talk to the borrower in person, help them with their loan listing, make sure all their claims are legit, etc. Plus, to keep a group's rating up, other members of a group have the option of helping a late borrower out by making a payment for them. It is an interesting setup, you can read better explanations on Prosper. Basically, if someone is part of a group, they are much less likely to default.
Endorsements are also important. Typically, an endorsement comes from a friend of the borrower who is already an established member of the Prosper community, either as a borrower or a lender. It looks very good if someone makes an endorsement then bids on the loan. This also means there is someone who personally knows the borrower and will check up on them if they are late with a payment.
These social aspects to Prosper make things better for both the borrower and lender. If a loan listing shows the borrower as part of a group, lenders are more likely to bid. This makes it more likely that the borrower's loan will get funded, and that the bidding will continue and lower their rate. And, the winning lenders can be more confident that their loans won't default.
As I alluded to earlier, these social evaluation tools should not be used alone to choose loans - they should be used to help you decide between loans of similar risk levels that you have already deemed acceptable for your portfolio.
Scott, I think your first goal should be to convince the MRS to let you put in the minimum $250 or a little more, choose loans, and give it 3-6 months. Then, you can do what I'm doing, which is evaluate how it is going, how comfortable you are with this type of investment, and how it can fit into your overall personal finance goals. Like I said before, I'm leaning towards lowering my 401(k) contribution and putting that long term investment money into Prosper instead. It is money that is already taken out of my budget, that I know I won't need anytime soon, so I am comfortable with it not being a liquid asset.
Steve
stevescookingjournal.blogspot.com
At September 19, 2008 7:45 PM ,
OnTheFence said...
Loan portfolios do not age well. Go back to Ericscc.com and use these parameters:
* Avg Age > 365
* Loan Count > 30
http://www.ericscc.com/stats/lender-return-distribution
With those parameters, it no longer looks quite as easy. The mean is -1.04% & the median is 0.00% ROI.
Estimated ROI tends to settle down to the true ROI after they have aged about a year.
Also by setting Loan Count to > 30 you eliminate those who just happened to get lucky gambling style by only throwing in a few loans & the quiting.
If you are interested in hashing out ideas, please feel free to visit the forums on prospers.org. Prospers.org has the oldest most experienced set of prosper.com lending veterans. (No we don't sell anything, it's just a forum for people who use prosper.com).
At September 19, 2008 7:53 PM ,
Anonymous said...
@Steve - For the love of god don't put your 401k funds into Prosper.
Fun money? Sure. Gambling money? Might as well. Retirement money? Only if you don't feel like having money to retire on.
Let me break it to you this way. You current approach to lending is going to put you on the negative side of the ROI curve as it ages. Your ROI only looks good right now because your portfolio has not matured.
At September 19, 2008 7:54 PM ,
OnTheFence said...
Sorry. Last comment was mine.
-On The Fence.
At September 24, 2008 1:34 PM ,
Steve said...
@onthefence
I just signed up for the lender forum access on prosper.org, thanks for pointing me to that.
Based on posts like http://www.prospers.org/forum/prosper_evaluation_final_note-t3094.0.html , it looks like groups and endorsements are nearly pointless and should be ignored, and that Prosper still has some fundamental flaws that are being ironed out.
As far as my investments resulting in a negative ROI eventually, you are probably right - my approach over the last 6 months has been to put in a very small amount of money, spread it over every credit grade and loan purpose, then watch. So far I'm doing better than average, but as you point out, I'm only 1/6 of the way into my oldest loans.
As far as 401(k) money, I am currently not expecting a positive return on it in the next 1-5 years. I've seen my conservative, non-volatile investments become very volatile, although my contributions have now been re-structured and things are leveling out. I was considering lowering my 401(k) investment from 5% to 4% until it performs a little better, even though I would lose 0.5% of employer contributions - not too smart, but I was losing more than that anyway until recently. I would consider the small amount of money that would be freed up expendable and use it to experiment with other investments, like Prosper, increased savings, or an increase in my non-401(k) stock/bond portfolio, which is doing well.
So, I was thinking about lowering my investment into my currently under-performing 401(k) for a year or so to explore other options. It is unlikely that I will do this, just a thought I started kicking around. However, I have pretty much decided to leave my 401(k) alone and wait until my next raise in a few months to have a little extra expendable income to play with. Most of that will be put into savings, but I think one or two carefully considered Prosper loans per month would be an acceptable risk, and a fun hobby.
Thanks for the good advice,
Steve
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